The episode that defined paradox

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The episode that defined paradox

Post by Perry » Thu May 07, 2009 5:28 pm

This episode was just ridiculous in the amount of paradoxes there were. I just got annoyed by them all, and all the unexplained reasonings for changing the future. I'm so frustrated that I can't even write this post properly. Ellie reading diary, compass never being manufactured (was implied, but i'll still hold onto the hope that he has a 2nd compass), Locke being the one that informs Richard of what to tell him...
...argh i'll stop before i get more annoyed, but feel free to vent your paradox frustration here.

Also found it strange that Kate didn't bring up the fact that she would be in jail if Jack's plan worked and they disappear and end up back on 815, even though that still can't work without paradox.

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Re: The episode that defined paradox

Post by Stephen » Thu May 07, 2009 8:32 pm

Jumped the Dharma shark.

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Re: The episode that defined paradox

Post by David3 » Thu May 07, 2009 9:14 pm

In order of worse to less worse...

Stopping The Plane Crash
No matter what theory of time travel you believe, it's impossible. With whatever happened, happened, the past is set and no changes can be made. In you can change the past, preventing the plane crash prevents them from going back in time and preventing the plane crash.

The Compass From Thin Air
This one is stupid becasue it would have been so easy to avoid. Just show us two compasses and there's no problem. But we see the Alpert specifically gave Locke the same compass Locke gave him in 1954, which was the same compass Alpert gave Locke and so on. The compass is in a loop and was never made.

Present Locke Tells Past Locke What To Do. With whatever happened, happened, I don't see any problems with this one. It seems kind of weird because both versions of Locke are timetraveling, but it's the equivalent of going back in time and telling yourself what's going to happen. But with whatever happened, happened, there's never an original timeline where Locke doesn't send Richard out to visit himself, it just always happened.

Ellie Reading the Journal I don't see the paradox.

So far, I think the only paradox that has actually happened is the compass. There should have been two compasses. Richard should have given Locke his compass and Richard would still have in his posession a much older version of the same compass.

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Re: The episode that defined paradox

Post by TheRadioTower » Thu May 07, 2009 11:51 pm

If you guys think that compass is a paradox then pretty much everything this season is a paradox. The compass is part of the closed-time loop, it exists within that that loop between 1954-2007-1954, it does not exist outside of that loop. And by its very nature the loop does not have an origin point. For Richard the compass originated from 2004 Locke, for 2004 Locke the compass originates from Richard there is no way to objectively say where the compass originated. There have been a couple of example of similar things this season where an idea originated due to the loop... here I guess because there is a physical object people are able to visualize it and have a problem with it.

I also fail to see where the "paradox" is with Eloise and the diary and Richard-Locke interaction.

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Re: The episode that defined paradox

Post by Perry » Sat May 09, 2009 3:56 am

No, most of the aspects of the season have not had aspects that would lead to paradoxes or enigmas like these few examples.
Ellie reading the journal leads to a paradox because of the fact that you can't define where she came up with those words to write to Dan. You could say that she forgot what she read and just happened to write exactly the same thing when she buys the journal, but she still will have been influenced by her own words, which doesn't make sense.
This is the same as Locke getting information and telling Richard to tell him the information.
The compass seems to have come out of thin air, which doesn't make any sense. As I said, I'll maintain that he has a 2nd compass in his left pocket, lol. (Found that weird he was carrying that around in his pocket)

The rest of the season, at least as they have depicted it so far, does not have this sort of problem where information seemingly comes from nowhere.

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